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Bonita

Archeology in Abner's Philadelphia

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Guest EEB aka AASB-AWSW

. . . .

It is from dualism that messianic expectations arise because it is the only way to solve the problem that dualism presents. Zoroaster worked to incorporate Melchizedek teachings into the prevalent dualistic religion by introducing the idea that the one and only God will be the eventual victor or savior in a dualistic existence. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the dualism and its cure, the end-time messiah, pre-dated Zoroaster but I'm not sure if it pre-dated Melchizedek. It probably did because the Sumerians had a dualistic religion which predates Melchizedek.

. . . .

 

Yes it did. But what has been manifested through Zoroaster is a slight corruption of the original dualistic religion of the ancients. Zoroaster's original concept followed along the lines of white magic which counters black magic, so to speak on a metaphysical basis. Basically first mentioned with Lilith, in the Babylonian Talmud. Therefore puts the time frame back to Genesis.

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Scholars are in disagreement as to when Genesis was written. They claim that if it was written by Moses, it would have been written between 1440 and 1400 B.C. Currently we are told that Genesis had four different authors from 850-450 BC; either way, long after Melchizedek.

 

74:8.7 The Old Testament account of creation dates from long after the time of Moses; he never taught the Hebrews such a distorted story. But he did present a simple and condensed narrative of creation to the Israelites, hoping thereby to augment his appeal to worship the Creator, the Universal Father, whom he called the Lord God of Israel.

 

TUB tells us that the creation story in Genesis was rewritten sometime around the Babylonian captivity in the 5th century BC and that it was revised and heavily influenced by Babylonian myths.

 

74:8.9 The Hebrews did little writing until about 900 B.C., and having no written language until such a late date, they had several different stories of creation in circulation, but after the Babylonian captivity they inclined more toward accepting a modified Mesopotamian version.

 

Also, the Mithraic religion is extremely ancient messianic religion which predates Zoroastrianism.

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Guest EEB aka AASB-AWSW

My use of the word Genesis was not necessarily meant to point to the Biblical but the Creation, or to be more specific, the reason for creation, which is not written in books but in the ancestral self. Yes there are many stories regarding creation and there is no one that is complete but the truth of creation lays in the mind of the heart who possesses the knowledge of the ancient of days. The UB tends to show that most actions must be approved by them in order to proceed. In many ways it is a reverse architecture or blue-print of the Universe, not always meant to be found or understood by those who do not have the capacity to think freely.

 

P.S.: The story about the creation that Jesus told Andrew and Phillip, in private, was not complete but did set in their mind a truth which they could understand with the knowledge they had at that time for understanding, yet was only a partial truth.

Edited by EEB aka AASB-AWSW

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My use of the word Genesis was not necessarily meant to point to the Biblical but the Creation, or to be more specific, the reason for creation, which is not written in books but in the ancestral self.

 

Huh? What? Written in the ancestral self . . . what the heck is that?

 

P.S.: The story about the creation that Jesus told Andrew and Phillip, in private, was not complete but did set in their mind a truth which they could understand with the knowledge they had at that time for understanding, yet was only a partial truth.

 

What private conversation are you talking about? I don't recall such a thing, but perhaps I've forgotten. Can you give me the specific quote? And all truth outside of Paradise is relative and therefore partial.

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Guest EEB aka AASB-AWSW

Huh? What? Written in the ancestral self . . . what the heck is that?

. . . .

What private conversation are you talking about? I don't recall such a thing, but perhaps I've forgotten. Can you give me the specific quote? And all truth outside of Paradise is relative and therefore partial.

. . . .

 

As for the first, "germ plasm", more specifically " immortal germ":

 

(1459.6) 132:3.6 Faith acts to release the superhuman activities of the divine spark, the immortal germ, that lives within the mind of man, and which is the potential of eternal survival. Plants and animals survive in time by the technique of passing on from one generation to another identical particles of themselves. The human soul (personality) of man survives mortal death by identity association with this indwelling spark of divinity, which is immortal, and which functions to perpetuate the human personality upon a continuing and higher level of progressive universe existence. The concealed seed of the human soul is an immortal spirit. The second generation of the soul is the first of a succession of personality manifestations of spiritual and progressing existences, terminating only when this divine entity attains the source of its existence, the personal source of all existence, God, the Universal Father.

 

As I mentioned, "private, teaching", so you would need to ask Andrew or Phillip, besides as the old saying goes, "so shall it be written, so shall it be done." Time and space can be a bummer.

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Yes it did. But what has been manifested through Zoroaster is a slight corruption of the original dualistic religion of the ancients. Zoroaster's original concept followed along the lines of white magic which counters black magic, so to speak on a metaphysical basis. Basically first mentioned with Lilith, in the Babylonian Talmud. Therefore puts the time frame back to Genesis.

 

 

As for the first, "germ plasm", more specifically " immortal germ":

 

(1459.6) 132:3.6 Faith acts to release the superhuman activities of the divine spark, the immortal germ, that lives within the mind of man, and which is the potential of eternal survival. . . . .

 

 

So you're saying that the dualism, of which Zoroastrianism is an example, goes back to Genesis which is the germ plasm of the ancestral self which is the Thought Adjuster?

 

As I mentioned, "private, teaching", so you would need to ask Andrew or Phillip, besides as the old saying goes, "so shall it be written, so shall it be done." Time and space can be a bummer.

 

And also, how do you know about these private conversations between Jesus, Andrew and Philip if they are truly private? Do they have something to do with the germ plasm too?

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Guest EEB aka AASB-AWSW

 

. . . .

So you're saying that the dualism, of which Zoroastrianism is an example, goes back to Genesis which is the germ plasm of the ancestral self which is the Thought Adjuster?

. . . .

And also, how do you know about these private conversations between Jesus, Andrew and Philip if they are truly private? Do they have something to do with the germ plasm too?

 

I order to truly answer your questions I would have to re-write the UB but in an effort to simplify my responce I will use the following quote:

 

(451.2) 40:9.6 When a Spirit-fused mortal is told about the events of the unremembered past experience, there is an immediate response of experiential recognition within the soul (identity) of such a survivor which instantly invests the narrated event with the emotional tinge of reality and with the intellectual quality of fact; and this dual response constitutes the reconstruction, recognition, and validation of an unremembered facet of mortal experience.

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I order to truly answer your questions I would have to re-write the UB but in an effort to simplify my responce I will use the following quote:

 

(451.2) 40:9.6 When a Spirit-fused mortal is told about the events of the unremembered past experience, there is an immediate response of experiential recognition within the soul (identity) of such a survivor which instantly invests the narrated event with the emotional tinge of reality and with the intellectual quality of fact; and this dual response constitutes the reconstruction, recognition, and validation of an unremembered facet of mortal experience.

 

So, are you claiming to be a Spirit-fused mortal?

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Does not the Spirit of Truth reside in all of us?

 

What does the Spirit of Truth have to do with Spirit-fused mortals? They're not at all the same thing.

 

The Spirit of Truth is the Spirit of the Universal Father and the Creator Son.

 

194:2.3 In a certain sense, this Spirit of Truth is the spirit of both the Universal Father and the Creator Son.

 

194:2.16 4. The spirit of the Universal Father and the Creator Son — the Spirit of Truth, generally regarded as the spirit of the Universe Son.

 

A Spirit-fused mortal are creatures who fuse with a fragment of the premind spirit of the Third Source and Center.

 

30:1.101 The fragmentations of the premind spirit of the Third Source and Center, though hardly comparable to the Father fragments, should be here recorded. Such entities differ very greatly from Adjusters; they do not as such dwell on Spiritington, nor do they as such traverse the mind-gravity circuits; neither do they indwell mortal creatures during the life in the flesh. They are not prepersonal in the sense that the Adjusters are, but such fragments of premind spirit are bestowed upon certain of the surviving mortals, and fusion therewith constitutes them Spirit-fused mortals in contradistinction to Adjuster-fused mortals.

Edited by Bonita
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Guest EEB aka AASB-AWSW

What does the Spirit of Truth have to do with Spirit-fused mortals? They're not at all the same thing.

 

The Spirit of Truth is the Spirit of the Universal Father and the Creator Son.

 

194:2.3 In a certain sense, this Spirit of Truth is the spirit of both the Universal Father and the Creator Son.

 

194:2.16 4. The spirit of the Universal Father and the Creator Son — the Spirit of Truth, generally regarded as the spirit of the Universe Son.

 

A Spirit-fused mortal are creatures who fuse with a fragment of the premind spirit of the Third Source and Center.

 

30:1.101 The fragmentations of the premind spirit of the Third Source and Center, though hardly comparable to the Father fragments, should be here recorded. Such entities differ very greatly from Adjusters; they do not as such dwell on Spiritington, nor do they as such traverse the mind-gravity circuits; neither do they indwell mortal creatures during the life in the flesh. They are not prepersonal in the sense that the Adjusters are, but such fragments of premind spirit are bestowed upon certain of the surviving mortals, and fusion therewith constitutes them Spirit-fused mortals in contradistinction to Adjuster-fused mortals.

 

Contradistinction

 

http://http://www.bing.com/...ing&FORM=DTPDIA

 

1. marked differentiation: differentiation between two things by identifying their contrasting qualities

 

Would it also not be possible that one mortal could be fused by two entities as in a triune nature.

Edited by EEB aka AASB-AWSW

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Would it also not be possible that one mortal could be fused by two entities as in a triune nature.

 

Fusion can only occur with one aspect of Deity, either the First, Second or Third Person. The choices are either Father fused, Son fused or Spirit fused, but only one, and no one fuses with the Spirit of Truth. Also . . . if you're fused to any one of the three, you wouldn't be typing posts on this forum.

 

40:9.1 Ascending Spirit-fused mortals are not Third Source personalities; they are included in the Father’s personality circuit, but they have fused with individualizations of the premind spirit of the Third Source and Center. Such Spirit fusion never occurs during the span of natural life; it takes place only at the time of mortal reawakening in the morontia existence on the mansion worlds. In the fusion experience there is no overlapping; the will creature is either Spirit fused, Son fused, or Father fused. Those who are Adjuster or Father fused are never Spirit or Son fused.

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Guest EEB aka AASB-AWSW

Yes this may be true, but if one is fused with the Father, also being a Son, would they not take on the ability to experience the variable triunities? If I am not mistaken, which I researched yesterday, that there are enumerable combinations which have not been presented in the UB.

Edited by EEB aka AASB-AWSW

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The Thought Adjuster is not the Son. Father-fused individuals fuse with the Thought Adjuster which is a fragment of the Universal Father alone. The Eternal Son does not fragment.

 

7:5.3 The purely personal nature of the Eternal Son is incapable of fragmentation.

 

Son-fused personalities fuse with individualized bestowals of the spirit of the Creator Son, which are not the same as the Spirit of Truth.

 

107:1.7 As the Universal Father fragmentizes his prepersonal Deity, so does the Infinite Spirit individuate portions of his premind spirit to indwell and actually to fuse with the evolutionary souls of the surviving mortals of the spirit-fusion series. But the nature of the Eternal Son is not thus fragmentable; the spirit of the Original Son is either diffuse or discretely personal. Son-fused creatures are united with individualized bestowals of the spirit of the Creator Sons of the Eternal Son.

 

The Spirit of Truth is the Spirit of the Father and the Son. The Spirit of Truth is not fuseable.

 

What triunity are you referring to exactly? Are you thinking of the Trinity embrace, trinitization, which can happen only after reaching finaliter status?

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Guest EEB aka AASB-AWSW

2. The Absolute Basis for Supremacy

 

(1261.1) 115:2.1 From the existential standpoint, nothing new can happen throughout the galaxies, for the

completion of infinity inherent in the I AM is eternally present in the seven Absolutes, is functionally

associated in the triunities, and is transmitively associated in the triodities. But the fact that infinity is thus

existentially present in these absolute associations in no way makes it impossible to realize new cosmic

experientials. From a finite creature’s viewpoint, infinity contains much that is potential, much that is on the

order of a future possibility rather than a present actuality.

 

(1261.2) 115:2.2 Value is a unique element in universe reality. We do not comprehend how the value of

anything infinite and divine could possibly be increased. But we discover that meanings can be modified if

not augmented even in the relations of infinite Deity. To the experiential universes even divine values are

increased as actualities by enlarged comprehension of reality meanings.

 

(1261.3) 115:2.3 The entire scheme of universal creation and evolution on all experiencing levels is apparently

a matter of the conversion of potentialities into actualities; and this transmutation has to do equally with

the realms of space potency, mind potency, and spirit potency.

 

(1261.4) 115:2.4 The apparent method whereby the possibilities of the cosmos are brought into actual

existence varies from level to level, being experiential evolution in the finite and experiential eventuation in

the absonite. Existential infinity is indeed unqualified in all-inclusiveness, and this very all-inclusiveness

must, perforce, encompass even the possibility for evolutionary finite experiencing. And the possibility for

such experiential growth becomes a universe actuality through triodity relationships impinging upon and in

the Supreme.

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This thread is about Abner. You made a statement that Andrew and Philip had secret information about duality, which is something that Abner would have believed in. Then you went on to say that you had access to secret knowledge about creation that was given to Andrew and Philip because of some kind of fusion phenomenon. Now you've gone way, way off topic talking about the Absolutes and triunities. May I suggest that you start your own thread?

 

Do you have something to add to the conversation about Abner and Philadelphia?

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Guest EEB aka AASB-AWSW

. . . .

Do you have something to add to the conversation about Abner and Philadelphia?

 

Noop, I think I made my point! Thank You.

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Is it possible that the group of Jesus' followers known as the Nazarenes were the original Jewish believers in the kingdom teachings?

 

 

 

Nazarene Jewish Christianity is a comprehensive study of the heirs of the earliest Jerusalem church, their history and doctrines, their relations with both synagogue and the growing Gentile church. The author analyzes all sources, Jewish, Christian, and pagan, which can throw light on the sect and its ultimate mysterious disappearance. He also deals with the Birkat haMinim and historicity of the flight to Pella.

http://www.amazon.co...sh+christianity

 

According to the author, the Nazarenes as a faith basically vanished after the conversion of Constantine.

Edited by Howard509

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The real question, (and i will leave this to others smarter and more educated than I) is, "what lessons do Paul and Abner give to us and our stewardship of the Urantia Papers?"

 

No compromise no bridge?

 

Its confusing though, because those very same compromises were detrimental to the original gospel message and stand as a great obstacle for the reception of the 5th epochal in this age.

 

So this brings us to the question, should we compromise the UB for the sake of numbers? If not then why, because Abner seems to be vilified for remaining true to the original gospel that was hijacked by Paul?

 

Colter

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