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Can an evil life lead to death?

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I think that it is important to remember that the Lanonandek Sons are one of the lowest levels of descending Sons. The following quote explains that the farther down the scale of life a personality is, the harder it is to envision the Universal Father in the Creator Son. Lucifer lost the ability to see the Father in the Son, and this really was his downfall. Instead, he turned to pride of self and envisioned himself in a position of power. Lucifer did not need an Adjuster, he just needed to recognize and relate his own Father and his remarkable personality.

 

p361:1 32:3.6 The farther down the scale of life we go, the more difficult it becomes to locate, with the eye of faith, the invisible Father. The lower creatures—and sometimes even the higher personalities—find it difficult always to envisage the Universal Father in his Creator Sons. And so, pending the time of their spiritual exaltation, when perfection of development will enable them to see God in person, they grow weary in progression, entertain spiritual doubts, stumble into confusion, and thus isolate themselves from the progressive spiritual aims of their time and universe. In this way they lose the ability to see the Father when beholding the Creator Son. The surest safeguard for the creature throughout the long struggle to attain the Father, during this time when inherent conditions make such attainment impossible, is tenaciously to hold on to the truth-fact of the Father's presence in his Sons. Literally and figuratively, spiritually and personally, the Father and the Sons are one. It is a fact: He who has seen a Creator Son has seen the Father.

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If I am not mistaken, I believe the Thought Adjuster's as far as created spiritual being's are on par as the most integrous beings in the universe. I agree that there is no excuse for rebellion and these beings can access the father threw the son, but it is IMO etleast understandable how these being's can potentially fall into sin seing as though they have no direct divine compass that points/directionalize's Godward (thought adjuster).

Edited by boomshuka

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If I am not mistaken, I believe the Thought Adjuster's as far as created spiritual being's are on par as the most integrous beings in the universe. I agree that there is no excuse for rebellion and these beings can access the father threw the son, but it is IMO etleast understandable how these being's can potentially fall into sin seing as though they have no direct divine compass that points/directionalize's Godward (thought adjuster).

 

But he had access to divine mind and personality. Personality comes directly from God and responds to the personality circuit of the Father. There really is no excuse for admiration of the self when you are graced with such gifts. Lucifer glorified and worshipped himself rather than "other-than-self", which could have been the Father or the Son, and that was the heart of his problem . . . no heart and no gratitude for those gifts of love.

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I know! I'm in such a state of shock, I hardly know what to say . . . haven't been able to think straight ever since. I think it may have actually caused a break in the time-space continuum.

LOL LOL! I hope this is your sense of humour, I find this statement quite humorous! :)

 

But, not to continue with your break in your time-space continuum, I also agree.

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Indeed Lucifer could envision the father, but for us mortals we can actually discover the living father. Not saying its an excuse to be lucifer though lol, but I understand they have a few more obstacles than we do.

Edited by boomshuka

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In our superuniverse, Nebadon comes in "next-to-last" in the loss ratio for Lanonandeks because they are created with such a high degree of volition/liberty. Speculators in Uversa think that though this is problematic in the short run, it will pay off "big time" down the line, when things settle down. P.393 - §8

 

The big problem continues to be a decided lack of patience in all orders of personalities. Witness our Eve and her Adam who were only here just a short while (100 years + or -) before they "lost their focus" and started "ad-libbing" the agreed upon and stated (and restated, repeatedly) plan of progressive planetary spiritual attainment. Their default "deprived the races of that superior type of physical nature which would have been more consonant with spiritual aspirations" while the Lucifer/Caligastia betrayal "precipitated world-wide confusionand "robbed all subsequent generations of the moral assistance which a well-ordered society would have provided."382-4

 

Further impatience drove Jesus' closest associates to rush out in a tidal wave of emotion and compromise years of close and personal instruction in the gospel of the kingdom by proclaiming the "risen christ," losing sight of the courageous, valiant human hero, Joshua ben Joseph. The most effective presentation of Divinity, ever in this universe, was the Master's sublime life overwhelmed by fervor and lost for two thousand years.

 

The list of "want it now" continues on in this latest revelation with short-sighted and self-assertive "know-it-alls" struggling for control of the revelation, printing pirate books, attacking the Foundation ( whom the Divine Counselor who supervised the Fifth Epochal Revelation entrusted with it's protection and watchcare) and lately usurping it's legal copyright ownership in U.S. Federal Court.

 

P.736 - §6 The universe of universes, including this small world called Urantia, is not being managed merely to meet our approval nor just to suit our convenience, much less to gratify our whims and satisfy our curiosity. The wise and all-powerful beings who are responsible for universe management undoubtedly know exactly what they are about; and so it becomes Life Carriers and behooves mortal minds to enlist in patient waiting and hearty co-operation with the rule of wisdom, the reign of power, and the march of progress

 

 

Agondonters develop the patience necessary to develop inner certitude by the vigourous exercise of FAITH. This ability is rare and precious and we should not underestimate the eternal values nurtured by selfless cosmic consciousness. Adam and Eve knew no real sin before coming here. When deprived of the comfort and reassurance of all the support systems available on Jerusem, they lost sight of their goal in a very short while. Perhaps Lucifer wasjealous of all the solicitude and effort expended upon mortal ascenders as they passed through "his" realm. We do know he had his own ideas about how things should be and we witnessed the terrible "orgy of darkness and death" his impatience caused.

 

The manifold spiritual influences that guide and sustain us here on Urantia are not available uniformly to all in Nebadon. With the Truth Spirit and a Father Fragment we have the potential infinity of divine identity and the loving personal presence of Jesus to walk beside us on the Paradise Path of Progressive Perfection. I give thanks and am exceedingly happy.

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Guest one4all
The list of "want it now" continues on in this latest revelation with short-sighted and self-assertive "know-it-alls" struggling for control of the revelation, printing pirate books, attacking the Foundation ( whom the Divine Counselor who supervised the Fifth Epochal Revelation entrusted with it's protection and watchcare) and lately usurping it's legal copyright ownership in U.S. Federal Court.

 

When reading your post above the word "Wiseacring" comes to mind as an appropriate definition.

 

 

The manifold spiritual influences that guide and sustain us here on Urantia are not available uniformly to all in Nebadon. With the Truth Spirit and a Father Fragment we have the potential infinity of divine identity and the loving personal presence of Jesus to walk beside us on the Paradise Path of Progressive Perfection. I give thanks and am exceedingly happy.

 

It's what they called "manifest destiny".

Also: regarding some specifics of your post I pose this question?

Have you ever been duck hunting? If so, you might know that duck blinds and decoys are used so that the ducks are attracted and not spooked.

 

When shooting at ducks flying in "V" formation, after lifting off of a lake or body of water, circling several times before flying away, you aim and shoot at the ducks at the back-end of the formation (to pick them off one by one) in order to get the whole flock. If you shoot at the point duck of the "V" first you will scatter the rest of the flock from fear of seeing the lead duck fall.

 

Sometimes you have to go back to the basics that your grand-parents either showed or told you about to better understand what was.

 

P.S.: I've noticed when trying to lookup some of the quotes that are posted my version of the UB does not match some of these posts. For reference, I'm using my first copy of the UB Second Printing 1995 - Soft cover. Actually I purchased the last copies of the Vinyl soft cover version (Third Printing - 1998) at the URANTIA, 2004 International Conference, in Chicago; what if any, are the changes from the versions that are being used in these posts?

Edited by one4all

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Yea I agree a lack of patience seem's to have caused alot of these being's to rebell.

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Guest rich

whatever that last part means about the combined nature.

 

157:6.10 But if the Son be lifted up, he will draw all men to himself, and whosoever believes this truth of the combined nature of the Son shall be endowed with life that is more than age-abiding.” whatever that last part means about the combined nature.

 

i'm not sure why i said that, it's simply that he's a creator son and also lived a life as a mortal.

 

Well, should we embark on a discussion about what the "combined nature of the Son" means and why those who believe in that truth will be "endowed with life that is more than age-abiding"? We already had a discussion on what it means by "lifted up", but I can't remember if it was this forum or elsewhere, so that might be an open topic too. Your decision.

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whatever that last part means about the combined nature.

 

157:6.10 But if the Son be lifted up, he will draw all men to himself, and whosoever believes this truth of the combined nature of the Son shall be endowed with life that is more than age-abiding.” whatever that last part means about the combined nature.

 

i'm not sure why i said that, it's simply that he's a creator son and also lived a life as a mortal.

 

The combined nature of the Son is the fact that the Father is in the Son and the Son is one with the Father. Jesus attempted to explain his combined nature at the Last Supper:

 

153:2.12 I am this bread of life. Your fathers ate manna in the wilderness and are dead. But this bread which comes down from God, if a man eats thereof, he shall never die in spirit. I repeat, I am this living bread, and every soul who attains the realization of this united nature of God and man shall live forever. And this bread of life which I give to all who will receive is
my own living and combined nature. The Father in the Son and the Son one with the Father
— that is my life-giving revelation to the world and my saving gift to all nations.”

 

The fact that Michael lived a mortal life is not so much the issue; it's that he lived a perfect mortal life thus revealing the Son to the Father while at the same time revealing the Father to his sons. Peter realized this:

 

157:5.1 The new and vital feature of Peter’s confession was the clear-cut recognition that Jesus was the Son of God, of his unquestioned divinity. Ever since his baptism and the wedding at Cana these apostles had variously regarded him as the Messiah, but it was not a part of the Jewish concept of the national deliverer that he should be divine. The Jews had not taught that the Messiah would spring from divinity; he was to be the “anointed one,” but hardly had they contemplated him as being “the Son of God.” In the second confession more emphasis was placed upon the
combined nature, the supernal fact that he was the Son of Man and the Son of God, and it was upon this great truth of the union of the human nature with the divine nature that Jesus declared he would build the kingdom of heaven
.

 

There is a difference between a dual nature and a combined nature. We mortals have dual natures (at least until fusion) and Jesus experienced a dual nature prior to his baptism. Following his baptism, Jesus revealed a combined nature. At least this is the way I currently understand it.

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102:1.1 It is literally true, “Human things must be known in order to be loved, but
divine things must be loved in order to be known
.”

 

Hey, that was Pascal who wrote that!

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Guest one4all
The fact that Michael [Jesus not Michael] lived a mortal life is not so much the issue; it's that he lived a perfect mortal life thus revealing the Son to the Father while at the same time revealing the Father to his sons. Peter realized this:

 

There is a difference between a dual nature and a combined nature. We mortals have dual natures (at least until fusion) and Jesus experienced a dual nature prior to his baptism. Following his baptism, Jesus revealed a combined nature. At least this is the way I currently understand it.

 

Bonita:

I don't disagree with what you are saying here; if I may put a little different lite on this subject.

 

In the UB intro, and serveral other places in the UB there are implications of a seven-fold type of mind.

 

If I may try to explain as I see it from my point of view:

 

The so called human nature (which we need to learn) is a dual-nature which can be combined or segragated.

 

IE.: Excluding animal nature from Human nature; Male Sexual, Female Sexual and BiSexual (3-sexual) or, (Male, Male, BiSexuality), (Female, Female, BiSexuality), etc. These natures come from the Root Human Body as a Hermaphrodite having been Uncombined which now can be a natural conflict between natures or like pseudohermaphrodite (Homo-Sexual (Hormonal imbalance etc.)), other wise like homo sapiens' ver. homo sapien-sapiens'.

 

The body can and does effect the way the mind functions!

 

Now, regrading the seven natured mind; If we assume that there are only 2 natures in man then his nature and actions can not be explained. If there are three natures, as in the trinity (Father, Son, Holy ((Spirit/(Ghost/Shadow)), or is this a triunity) then how do you combine. Combining two natures is easy (Bi), but what happens to (?(?(?)).)? - lost in space/eternity forever. So, therefore, the ((Spirit/(Ghost/Shadow)) has to attach/combin with the combining which is no longer a Bi.

 

Now, why did I use the expression Holy ((Spirit/(Ghost/Shadow))? Because Holy Spirit and Holy Ghost are found in speech and writing everywhere, interchangable or not? There can be a shadow when describining a triunion of the Spirit and Ghost.

 

Now, why was Father and not Mother used in the Trinity? Because it implies that Holy ((Spirit/(Ghost/Shadow)) is the Lost Mother of the Son. Male (X/Y) Female (X/X)

 

Please look at the following: (you will see the relation to XY, XX, XXY, XYY, XYX or YXY.

Y chromosome: From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Y chromosome is one of the two sex-determining chromosomes in most mammals, including humans. In mammals, it contains the gene SRY, which triggers testis development if present. The human Y chromosome is composed of about 60 million base pairs. DNA in the Y chromosome is passed from father to son, and Y-DNA analysis may thus be used in genealogy research.

 

So Bonita, all I am saying is that Jesus was able to combin all his natures when needed even the so-called Evil one's, which I'm sure you never want to SEE.

 

Now how many possible personalities does it take to make ?Thought Adjuster? Thats why we all need to find out who we are or want to BE. But be carefull what you want to BE - you may not be ready to experience, live or meet with the (D)evil; Yu'all. :D

Edited by one4all

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Guest rich

as i reread the quote in ub, jesus was referring to himself and the father as the combined, correct. you're definitions for combined and dual are fine, but i wouldn't try to label the difference too much. there's plenty of ways to explain us, fusion, jesus, the universal father, in terms of now and eternity, or during jesus prebaptismal life.

 

There is a difference between a dual nature and a combined nature. We mortals have dual natures (at least until fusion) and Jesus experienced a dual nature prior to his baptism. Following his baptism, Jesus revealed a combined nature. At least this is the way I currently understand it.

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I thought to add something else to this topic from what I hope is an uplifting angle, pertaining to the continuence of life - life after this life. Underlying the subject of the topic, can an evil life lead to death, is a question concerning survival.

 

P. 69 - §8
Eternal survival of personality is wholly dependent on the choosing of the mortal mind, whose decisions determine the survival potential of the immortal soul. When the mind believes God and the soul knows God, and when, with the fostering Adjuster, they all desire God, then is survival assured. Limitations of intellect, curtailment of education, deprivation of culture, impoverishment of social status, even inferiority of the human standards of morality resulting from the unfortunate lack of educational, cultural, and social advantages, cannot invalidate the presence of the divine spirit in such unfortunate and humanly handicapped but believing individuals. The indwelling of the Mystery Monitor constitutes the inception and insures the possibility of the potential of growth and survival of the immortal soul.

 

We're given an abundance of mercy credits. We're on the lowest rung of the ladder of life struggling along as best we can for the most part. We're gonna make mistakes in this life. Bound to happen. It's part of our education and training. They tell us this: ". . . if the seed sowing is evil, this merciful delay provides time for repentance and rectification."

 

P. 616 - §5
Supreme justice can act instantly when not restrained by divine mercy. But the ministry of mercy to the children of time and space always provides for this time lag, this saving interval between seedtime and harvest. If the seed sowing is good, this interval provides for the testing and upbuilding of character; if the seed sowing is evil, this merciful delay provides time for repentance and rectification. This time delay in the adjudication and execution of evildoers is inherent in the mercy ministry of the seven superuniverses. This restraint of justice by mercy proves that God is love, and that such a God of love dominates the universes and in mercy controls the fate and judgment of all his creatures.

 

How long has it been since the Lucifer Rebellion? Seems like a long time to us doesn't it? But maybe supreme justice concerning survival of personality occurs in less than a blink of eyes of God.

 

All the best,

Meredith

Edited by Meredith Van Woert

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Guest rich

14:1.12 One Paradise-Havona day is just seven minutes, three and one-eighth seconds less than one thousand years of the present Urantia leap-year calendar.

 

who knows what's happened adjudication-wise. satan was gone about 2,000 years after christ around the writing of this book, so how much longer before caligastia's removed? who knows.

 

How long has it been since the Lucifer Rebellion? Seems like a long time to us doesn't it? But maybe supreme justice concerning survival of personality occurs in less than a blink of eyes of God.

 

All the best,

Meredith

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14:1.12 One Paradise-Havona day is just seven minutes, three and one-eighth seconds less than one thousand years of the present Urantia leap-year calendar.

 

who knows what's happened adjudication-wise. satan was gone about 2,000 years after christ around the writing of this book, so how much longer before caligastia's removed? who knows.

 

On the subject of evil, error, sin and iniquity:

 

P.613 - §1
Evolutionary man finds it difficult fully to comprehend the significance and to grasp the meanings of evil, error, sin, and iniquity. Man is slow to perceive that contrastive perfection and imperfection produce
potential evil
; that conflicting truth and falsehood create
confusing error
; that the divine endowment of freewill choice eventuates in the
divergent realms of sin and righteousness
; that the persistent pursuit of divinity leads to the kingdom of God as contrasted with its
continuous rejection, which leads to the domains of iniquity
.

 

The good news:

 

P. 616 - §6
The mercy delays of time are by the mandate of the free will of the Creators. There is good to be derived in the universe from this technique of patience in dealing with sinful rebels. While it is all too true that good cannot come of evil to the one who contemplates and performs evil, it is equally true that all things (including evil, potential and manifest) work together for good to all beings who know God, love to do his will, and are ascending Paradiseward according to his eternal plan and divine purpose.

 

All the best,

Meredith

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Satan is now unqualifiedly detained on the Jerusem prison worlds.

 

 

FORMER URANTIANS SUPERVISE ALL 37 PLANETS IN REBELLION

 

 

P.1252 - §2 The members of this same commission of former Urantians also act as advisory supervisors of the thirty-six other rebellion-isolated worlds in Satania; they perform a very valuable service in keeping Lanaforge, the System Sovereign, in close and sympathetic touch with the affairs of these planets, which still remain more or less under the overcontrol of the Constellation Fathers of Norlatiadek. These twenty-four counselors make frequent trips as individuals to each of the quarantined planets, especially to Urantia.

 

 

The apostate Planetary Princes claim of legitimacy is even now being tried on Uversa before the tribunals of the Ancients of Days. Michael's "elder brother" Immanuel, the Paradise Union of Days proclaimed our Creator Son Planetary Prince. Michael's only gesture toward personal administration of this planet was naming the Four and Twenty councilors as advisory administrators.

 

 

From Paradise to Edentia, all counseled to allow rebellion to run its course, that every spirit, every ascender, every intelligence be allowed to make a full and free choice as to whether or not to embrace rebellion. A council of Mighty Messengers, onetime mortals who had traveled the Paradise Path to Eternity and returned in service to the worlds of time and space counseled Gabriel that three times the number would be lost if "arbitrary or summary methods of suppression" were used.

 

(This is told on page 617 of the Urantia Book, "The Wisdom of Delay.")

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