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Is the Urantia Book holy?


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#41 Bradly aka/fanofVan

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:39 PM

Brother Bill says above:

Posted 20 January 2013 - 07:50 PM

ONLY GOD IS HOLY

Me here: This is the only conclusion I can reach as well. In the Revelation, a word search of "holy" brings up 16 pages of references. In most, the uncapped "holy" refers to that which mortals have self determined to be "holy", including the early primitives who began the determinations of history of the things and the people that are holy while Holy (capped) is only used to describe the Mother or Holy Spirit. This is telling to me as I am of the mind that only those and that infused with Father and/or Mother and/or Son can be truly Holy in any universe sense of the word.

Friend Howard posted the quote: " (1104.6) 101:1.3 The divine spirit makes contact with mortal man, not by feelings or emotions, but in the realm of the highest and most spiritualized thinking. It is your thoughts, not your feelings, that lead you Godward. The divine nature may be perceived only with the eyes of the mind. But the mind that really discerns God, hears the indwelling Adjuster, is the pure mind. “Without holiness no man may see the Lord.” All such inner and spiritual communion is termed spiritual insight. Such religious experiences result from the impress made upon the mind of man by the combined operations of the Adjuster and the Spirit of Truth as they function amid and upon the ideas, ideals, insights, and spirit strivings of the evolving sons of God."

If holiness is derived from holy, then this too is saying that the mind/soul which knows God and His Holiness, then may man see the Lord - the God fused mind can see God and no other....almost as if only God may see Himself. Our first viewing does not come until finaliter status is achieved which is the first time we are spiritized sufficiently to view Him.

I am convinced that no thing can ever be truly holy or Holy either one. That without God within it, it cannot be thus. Primitivism claims much to be holy in its search for the God that lives within the mind and spirit of those who ascribe such reality to inanimate objects - relics, fetishes, charms, hills, mountains, books, grails, burial clothes, splinters, etc. While Father is the creator of all, He is not found within all the materials of His creation but in all the beings, personalities, and minds of all the universes - in and out of time and space.

Until the text is read and the reader is changed thereby, there is nothing holy. When the holiness occurs within the mind of the seeker, then it is that experience which is holy and still not the text itself. Holiness is an experience within and never an object or it is a person of the trinity...the Holy one. A holy man/woman would then be, by this definition, one who knows God and acts thusly....not one who claims such or accepts such designation by others....like the priests for example. There are priests who may be holy but not because they or any other mortal says so. God defines holy. And as Brother Bill says,

ONLY GOD IS HOLY

Edited by Bradly aka/fanofVan, 23 January 2013 - 05:43 PM.

Peace be upon you."

#42 Coop

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 10:50 PM

Isnt The Isle of Paradise A HOLY Place ?

'' the Most Holy Sphere, and the Holy Area.''

'' the Most Holy Sphere of Paradise.''

'' the Holy Land sectors ''


11:3.1 On upper Paradise there are three grand spheres of activity, the Deity presence, the Most Holy Sphere, and the Holy Area. The vast region immediately surrounding the presence of the Deities is set aside as the Most Holy Sphere and is reserved for the functions of worship, trinitization, and high spiritual attainment. There are no material structures nor purely intellectual creations in this zone; they could not exist there. It is useless for me to undertake to portray to the human mind the divine nature and the beauteous grandeur of the Most Holy Sphere of Paradise. This realm is wholly spiritual, and you are almost wholly material. A purely spiritual reality is, to a purely material being, apparently nonexistent.


11:3.2 While there are no physical materializations in the area of the Most Holy, there are abundant souvenirs of your material days in the Holy Land sectors and still more in the reminiscent historic areas of peripheral Paradise.


11:3.3 The Holy Area, the outlying or residential region, is divided into seven concentric zones. Paradise is sometimes called “the Father’s House” since it is his eternal residence, and these seven zones are often designated “the Father’s Paradise mansions.” The inner or first zone is occupied by Paradise Citizens and the natives of Havona who may chance to be dwelling on Paradise. The next or second zone is the residential area of the natives of the seven superuniverses of time and space. This second zone is in part subdivided into seven immense divisions, the Paradise home of the spirit beings and ascendant creatures who hail from the universes of evolutionary progression. Each of these sectors is exclusively dedicated to the welfare and advancement of the personalities of a single superuniverse, but these facilities are almost infinitely beyond the requirements of the present seven superuniverses.


11:3.4 Each of the seven sectors of Paradise is subdivided into residential units suitable for the lodgment headquarters of one billion glorified individual working groups. One thousand of these units constitute a division. One hundred thousand divisions equal one congregation. Ten million congregations constitute an assembly. One billion assemblies make one grand unit. And this ascending series continues through the second grand unit, the third, and so on to the seventh grand unit. And seven of the grand units make up the master units, and seven of the master units constitute a superior unit; and thus by sevens the ascending series expands through the superior, supersuperior, celestial, supercelestial, to the supreme units. But even this does not utilize all the space available. This staggering number of residential designations on Paradise, a number beyond your concept, occupies considerably less than one per cent of the assigned area of the Holy Land. There is still plenty of room for those who are on their way inward, even for those who shall not start the Paradise climb until the times of the eternal future.

Edited by Coop, 23 January 2013 - 11:09 PM.


#43 -Scott-

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 12:51 AM

The "whole" or holy is also related to God the Mother who is our other parent. :). She is the individuality of the whole.

Edited by -Scott-, 24 January 2013 - 12:51 AM.

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#44 Bradly aka/fanofVan

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 07:22 AM

Good one Coop! I thought this would come up. I was not clear about "thing" for sure. Meant material "things" but I wasn't so clear, eh? Yes, I read those and it makes you wonder if it is the spirit nature of the location or if the Mother infuses those places?

11:3.2 While there are no physical materializations in the area of the Most Holy, there are abundant souvenirs of your material days in the Holy Land sectors and still more in the reminiscent historic areas of peripheral Paradise.


"souvenirs" ???????
Peace be upon you."

#45 Bonita

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 08:04 AM

Isn't holiness synonymous with righteousness? At least it is in my dictionary. TUB has plenty to say about righteousness. Howard asked how to attain holiness which is the same question as how do we attain righteousness, and TUB tells us exactly how to do that. It's very simple. We become holy or attain righteousness by sonship, by doing the will of God. There is no other way. It's not doing the will of the book, it's doing the will of God. You can't find the will of God in the book. You can only find the will of God by finding your soul and allowing the Spirit of Truth to walk with it while attuning your personality to your Thought Adjuster's exquisite call toward holiness and perfection. A righteous life is a life dedicated to doing the Father's will, a live of devotion to the loyalty of love.

137:8.13 The kingdom of heaven is not a matter of meat and drink but rather a life of progressive righteousness and increasing joy in the perfecting service of my Father who is in heaven.

140:6.3 I demand of you a righteousness that shall exceed the righteousness of those who seek to obtain the Father’s favor by almsgiving, prayer, and fasting. If you would enter the kingdom, you must have a righteousness that consists in love, mercy, and truth — the sincere desire to do the will of my Father in heaven.

150:5.5 Salvation is the gift of God, and righteousness is the natural fruit of the spirit-born life of sonship in the kingdom. You are not to be saved because you live a righteous life; rather is it that you live a righteous life because you have already been saved, have recognized sonship as the gift of God and service in the kingdom as the supreme delight of life on earth.

#46 Bradly aka/fanofVan

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 10:15 AM

Interesting topic but would like to balance things out in some ways. While I remain unconvinced that there actually are material things that are holy (in a universal sense), I believe any who seek Father and spirit and put faith into such a desire by holding objects sacred or holy, are making a minor error only and such objectification is hardly important to any in the universe when the struggling mortal thusly believes. This is hardly devil worship or athiesm or human sacrifice, but simply an immature and primitive expression of faith in that which is greater by the lesser seeking the greater. Such immaturity is probably considered "quaint" by the Reversionists who will guide us all beyond the many misconceptions we all bring in one form or another to our progressive adventure.

Just wanted to be sure no one is reading any judgement or superiority in my posts on this topic....for I remain blinded enough by the timbers in my eye and still choke on the camels I too swallow, if different ones, eh? Bless all who seek Father, wherever they seek or find Him, for all who so seek will find Him. Just maybe not where they thought.

Edited by Bradly aka/fanofVan, 24 January 2013 - 10:16 AM.

Peace be upon you."

#47 Coop

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 02:21 PM

This Statement ... '' there are abundant souvenirs of your material days ''
Also Has Me Curious and Perplexed .

Anyone Have Any Ideas About What Is Meant By ... '' abundant souvenirs '' ?

'' there are abundant souvenirs of your material days in the Holy Land sectors
and still more in the reminiscent historic areas of peripheral Paradise. ''

#48 Rick Warren

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 05:37 PM

...Anyone Have Any Ideas About What Is Meant By ... '' abundant souvenirs '' ?


Memories/experiences. No?

#49 Bill Martin

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 11:03 AM

I would say that the more God you have in you the Holier you are...
Slowly but surely the Power of Love is overcoming the Love of Power

#50 Bonita

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 01:41 PM

I would say that the more God you have in you the Holier you are...


Don't we all have the same amount of God in us, since he's no respecter of persons? That means we're all holy. Maybe the more qualities of God you have in your character, the holier you are, but who could judge? And they are:
  • Loving service
  • Unselfish devotion
  • Courageous loyalty
  • Sincere fairness
  • Enlightened honesty
  • Confiding trust
  • Merciful ministry
  • Unfailing goodness
  • Forgiving tolerance
  • Enduring peace
  • Love
  • Joy
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  • Gentleness
  • Faith
  • Meekness
  • Temperance


#51 Bill Martin

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:38 PM

"Many of you have this day come to the parting of the ways; you have come to a beginning of the making of the inevitable choice between the will of the Father and the self-chosen ways of darkness. And as you now choose, so shall you eventually be. You must either make the tree good and its fruit good, or else will the tree become corrupt and its fruit corrupt. I declare that in my Father's eternal kingdom the tree is known by its fruits. But some of you who are as vipers, how can you, having already chosen evil, bring forth good fruits? After all, out of the abundance of the evil in your hearts your mouths speak." (1714) (153-5)

It is a choice to abide with the Father.
Slowly but surely the Power of Love is overcoming the Love of Power

#52 Bonita

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 09:44 AM

Just because people deny God doesn't mean that God is not in them or that there is less of him in them. God gives the same amount of himself to everyone, a fragment. You can't put an amount on that. I don't think you can measure the amount of God anyone has as though God were a quantity. Isn't he a quality within the soul? I do think that there is such a thing as quantity when it comes to measuring the growth of the soul, however. And TUB tells us that we can measure that by our love for others and our trustworthiness.

156:5.17 The measure of the spiritual capacity of the evolving soul is your faith in truth and your love for man, but the measure of your human strength of character is your ability to resist the holding of grudges and your capacity to withstand brooding in the face of deep sorrow. Defeat is the true mirror in which you may honestly view your real self.

28:6.13 Trust is the crucial test of will creatures. Trustworthiness is the true measure of self-mastery, character.

If you want to talk about amounts, then less selfish qualities and more godlike qualities of one's character, perhaps? But I don't think you can say that one person has more God in him/her than another. It's more like one person may manifest more godlikeness than another, but that's about it. Either you have a fragment of God in you or you don't. One fragment is not bigger or smaller, more or less than the next, or at least we haven't been told that. One fragment may have more experience than another though, but I don't think that's a measure of holiness either. Maybe I'm nitpicking here, but I am a word junkie, unfortunately.

#53 Meredith Van Woert

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 11:10 AM

See Paper 159 http://www.urantia.o...h-jump-result-0 and read: "4. The Talk with Nathaniel" to find out what Jesus had to say on the topic.


All the best,
Meredith

#54 Bill Martin

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 07:53 PM

(1767.5) 159:4.3 These writings are the work of men, some of them holy men, others not so holy."(Jesus) Deity is characterized by the quality of unity--actual or potential--on all supermaterial levels of reality; and this unifying quality is best comprehended by creatures as divinity.(p.2) In any universe contest between actual levels of reality, the personality of the higher level will ultimately triumph over the personality of the lower level. This inevitable outcome of universe controversy is inherent in the fact that divinity of quality equals the degree of reality or actuality of any will creature.(P.37-3)

The foregoing are qualitative measurments available by secoraphic reflectivity (not on this planet till the rebellion is over). There is one quantitative measurement I found:P.140 - §1 "As the mind of any personality in the universe becomes more spiritual--Godlike--it becomes less responsive to material gravity. Reality, measured by physical-gravity response, is the antithesis of reality as determined by quality of spirit content. Physical-gravity action is a quantitative determiner of nonspirit energy; spiritual-gravity action is the qualitative measure of the living energy of divinity." (140 top)

Bonita, we can not make these judgments but they can be made. Some persons have more light. They have the same endowment but they have "focused their inner eye" on the Father and evolved further and faster. How could a Mighty Messenger tell us about the "race for perfection" if there was not differential attainment on the path to Paradise.

Yes God does not play favorites. Our God is just and merciful.

The "Fragments of God" are identical in potential. We are variable in our response to divine guidance.

Love You,

Bill
Slowly but surely the Power of Love is overcoming the Love of Power

#55 Bonita

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 09:12 AM

I agree Bill, that there are those who manifest more obvious fruit than others and I definitely agree about the spirit gravity circuit when it comes to the spiritualized mind. My only point was in the literal interpretation of your statement: I would say that the more God you have in you the Holier you are...

It's just my pain-in-the-a__ way of making the point that we all have the same amount of God in us. Some have discovered, recognized, interpreted and chosen God to a greater extent than others, which is what I think you meant. And the other point I wanted to make is that because we all have the same amount of God in us, whether we realize that fact or not, makes us all holy in God's eyes and potentially holy in human eyes. If we learn to see others like God the Father does, then we will be able to see holiness in even the most unholy of men/women because we will learn how to tell the difference between a person and his/her behavior.

Anyway, I think this quote sorta says the same thing about the amount of God you have been able to manifest in your life:

P.1726 - §2 "Let me emphatically state this eternal truth: If you, by truth co-ordination, learn to exemplify in your lives this beautiful wholeness of righteousness, your fellow men will then seek after you that they may gain what you have so acquired. The measure wherewith truth seekers are drawn to you represents the measure of your truth endowment, your righteousness. The extent to which you have to go with your message to the people is, in a way, the measure of your failure to live the whole or righteous life, the truth-co-ordinated life ."

Love you too.

#56 Guest_EEB aka AASB-AWSW_*

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 12:14 PM

Is the Urantia Book Holy?

Is the Book the wHole truth and nothing but the truth?

No, by its own admission, the authors, have stated that it is abridged. Therefore, anything that is not the whole word of God can not be the absolute word of God.

If a Book is Holy than a Book is equal to God?

Can a Book be equal to the word or for that matter the thought of God?

The fragment of God, our Father, has been noted as being distributed equally in the UB but it has also been noted that with this fragment we as individuals can become more like God but also have been warned what becoming perfect like God can do to actions which God reserves for Himself. Knowing who God is in His perfection, should make the bestowed more weary of achieving His perfection. In other words, can you really handle His truth and be restrained by His (this) perfection?

If you have been given an equal fragment of God, what have you done with that fragment? If you have filled your cup to its capacity to know the truth, have you become wHoly filed with God, or only filled to your capacity to being perfected?

If you take that fragment and allow it to grow in your heart so that the Father fuses with you, then at that time, you will be wHoly with the Father, and He will act through you not for you. If Jesus received the same fragment as did you, than compare what He did with it verses what you have done with the same.

Edited by EEB aka AASB-AWSW, 27 January 2013 - 09:50 PM.





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