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UB Stuff in Book of Mormon


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#41 Midsoniter woman

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 09:26 PM

I just watched the Len videos. Are there more than 2 episodes? I really enjoyed them. He's a great man for doing this, but the UB doesn't say it's okay to drink hard liquor and the UB doesn't oppose eternal marriage persay. I agree with him that you can commune with God all alone on a mountain top if you wish and make it to Paradise, but why would anyone want to? If you were listening to Jesus discourse on the gospel and decided to accept sonship with God and become a believer in the kingdom, why wouldn't you allow Peter or John to baptize you? Why would you shun the ceremony or shun the fellowship? There's no one in the UB who believed in Jesus, but refused baptism and other ceremonies. No one wanted to be a believer in Jesus all by themselves. There are ceremonies all over the universe administration. Ceremonies on universe headquarters and on Jerusem. Ceremonies are just part of life and not to be despised.

The UB doesn't use the word marriage, but they use the word companion. Everyone has a companion. The angels all live in pairs. One of the UB writers disclosed that he had the same companion with him now that he had while still in the flesh.

I realize that Jesus drank wine and even made wine, but wine is not the same as hard liquor or even beer. And Jesus didn't get drunk or hungover or drink alone. The body is healthier without this terrible addiction. The church promises health blessing for sobriety. There's nothing debatable about that. What kind of idiot would recommend taking up drinking? But on the whole I greatly enjoyed Len and I'm very grateful for his work.

Edited by Midsoniter woman, 05 March 2012 - 09:26 PM.

"If woman aspires literally to enjoy all of man's rights, then sooner or later, pitiless and emotionless competition will certainly replace that chivalry and special consideration which many women now enjoy, and which they have so recently won from men (Urantia Book, 938)."

#42 Midsoniter woman

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 08:32 PM

I did a Bible search for the quote about a hen gathering her chickens under her wings and nothing came up for any of those words. You know what? Let's not do any more Bible searches. If I can't do it right then we just won't. But I think they did a good job setting up the Relief Society much resembling the Women's Corp. And the resurrected Jesus appeared to the people in America using almost the same language as the UB morontia appearances. We know that the UB might not have been able to recount the hundreds of morontia appearances made by Jesus at the time of his resurrection. We really don't know how many appearances there were. The concept of the millenium always struck me as eerily similar to the UB description of the age of Light and Life. Where else have we heard of vegetarian animals except on Jerusem?

Edited by Midsoniter woman, 12 March 2012 - 08:34 PM.

"If woman aspires literally to enjoy all of man's rights, then sooner or later, pitiless and emotionless competition will certainly replace that chivalry and special consideration which many women now enjoy, and which they have so recently won from men (Urantia Book, 938)."

#43 Rev. Dr. Red

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 10:53 PM

Midsoniter,

There are countless Bible versions. Each version with its own language. They all may seem similar but they are not. Try YouVersion.com Its what I use. I mainly use KJV version of the Bible, but YouVersion gives access to over 22 (maybe more by now) versions of the Bible in one place.

#44 Midsoniter woman

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 11:46 PM

Thanks. I put in chickens into YouVersion and a quote came up in Matthew. This is the first Bible search engine that actually worked for me.


O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

Edited by Midsoniter woman, 30 November 2012 - 11:47 PM.

"If woman aspires literally to enjoy all of man's rights, then sooner or later, pitiless and emotionless competition will certainly replace that chivalry and special consideration which many women now enjoy, and which they have so recently won from men (Urantia Book, 938)."

#45 Howard509

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 07:23 PM

Is it possible that, after his resurrection, Jesus visited North America as the Book of Mormon states? Could this explain the Native American belief in a white-faced and bearded god who would come again?

Edited by Howard509, 05 December 2012 - 07:23 PM.

We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience. -
Teilhard de Chardin


#46 JR Sherrod

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 11:14 PM

Is it possible that, after his resurrection, Jesus visited North America as the Book of Mormon states? Could this explain the Native American belief in a white-faced and bearded god who would come again?


Well Howars509, the Urantia Book does not say that Jesus didn't visit the Americas. Beyond that, who knows? It certainly seems possible.
Ah! To be host to God, Himself; and to be enriched beyond measure by that incomprehensible treasure!

#47 Howard509

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 12:23 AM

Well Howars509, the Urantia Book does not say that Jesus didn't visit the Americas. Beyond that, who knows? It certainly seems possible.


My honest belief is that the Book of Mormon may have been a revelation to Joseph Smith and that he really did have a vision of Jesus and the Father, but that the church built around this revelation, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, is a highly institutionalized and dogmatic religion that may not have been what the revelation originally intended. Followers of Joseph Smith who chose not to follow after Brigham Young formed the Reorganized Church of Latter-Day Saints, which is today called Community of Christ.

We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience. -
Teilhard de Chardin


#48 Meredith Van Woert

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 12:15 PM

Hi,

I know some of you come from a Mormon background and I best be careful not to step on any toes. My own curiosity about the "religion" led me to this book,

http://www.amazon.co...ords=Fawn+Bodie


one of many I've read recently in order to find out, if possible, what it is that people get out of it. My guess is that once you're into it, by birth or by choice, it's hard to get out of. People who are into it must be getting something out of it and this is true of any religion I would think. I'm guessing, as I don't have a birth religion. Seems to me though, once you're into the UB, all else pales by comparison. I've come to a personal opinion that one's birth religion (or none) is one's religious default setting. People seem to want to find correspondences of their religion to the UB, all well and good. I suppose I would too, if I had one. My default setting is the UB.



The many religions of Urantia are all good to the extent that they bring man to God and bring the realization of the Father to man. It is a fallacy for any group of religionists to conceive of their creed as The Truth; such attitudes bespeak more of theological arrogance than of certainty of faith. There is not a Urantia religion that could not profitably study and assimilate the best of the truths contained in every other faith, for all contain truth. Religionists would do better to borrow the best in their neighbors' living spiritual faith rather than to denounce the worst in their lingering superstitions and outworn rituals. P.1012 - §4





Let's rejoice in our shared living spiritual faith! I am astonished at what people believe about the Mormon religion and others as well. I appreciate the efforts of Fawn Bodie to document her sources in her lengthy history of Joseph Smith. I recommend it.


All the best,
Meredith

#49 Bradly aka/fanofVan

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 12:48 PM

According to my understanding Joseph Smith did NOT claim the Book of Mormon was any revelation - he claims to have discovered the golden plates and he "interpreted or translated" them into english. He did claim later revelations, some of which were written - but not the core Mormon text. I have known many good and faithful Mormons and RLDS too and many teachings are closer to the realities presented in the 5th than many other christian religions. Perhaps I am mistaken about the Book of Mormon?

(884.2) 79:5.8 The red and the yellow races are the only human stocks that ever achieved a high degree of civilization apart from the influences of the Andites. The oldest Amerindian culture was the Onamonalonton center in California, but this had long since vanished by 35,000 B.C. In Mexico, Central America, and in the mountains of South America the later and more enduring civilizations were founded by a race predominantly red but containing a considerable admixture of the yellow, orange, and blue.

(884.3) 79:5.9 These civilizations were evolutionary products of the Sangiks, notwithstanding that traces of Andite blood reached Peru. Excepting the Eskimos in North America and a few Polynesian Andites in South America, the peoples of the Western Hemisphere had no contact with the rest of the world until the end of the first millennium after Christ. In the original Melchizedek plan for the improvement of the Urantia races it had been stipulated that one million of the pure-line descendants of Adam should go to upstep the red men of the Americas.

It is interesting that Mormons are taught that a "tribe of Israel" came by boat to South America as the Andites did indeed do.

(872.4) 78:4.6 These Andites were adventurous; they had roving dispositions. An increase of either Sangik or Andonite stock tended to stabilize them. But even so, their later descendants never stopped until they had circumnavigated the globe and discovered the last remote continent.

(873.3) 78:5.7 One hundred and thirty-two of this race, embarking in a fleet of small boats from Japan, eventually reached South America and by intermarriage with the natives of the Andes established the ancestry of the later rulers of the Incas. They crossed the Pacific by easy stages, tarrying on the many islands they found along the way. The islands of the Polynesian group were both more numerous and larger then than now, and these Andite sailors, together with some who followed them, biologically modified the native groups in transit. Many flourishing centers of civilization grew up on these now submerged lands as a result of Andite penetration. Easter Island was long a religious and administrative center of one of these lost groups. But of the Andites who navigated the Pacific of long ago none but the one hundred and thirty-two ever reached the mainland of the Americas.
Peace be upon you."

#50 Bonita

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 01:44 PM

It is interesting that Mormons are taught that a "tribe of Israel" came by boat to South America as the Andites did indeed do.


They must be using the phrase tribe of Israel metaphorically because there never were twelve tribes, only three or four and they settled in Palestine.

97:9.1 There never were twelve tribes of the Israelites — only three or four tribes settled in Palestine.

#51 JR Sherrod

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 12:40 PM

According to my understanding Joseph Smith did NOT claim the Book of Mormon was any revelation - he claims to have discovered the golden plates and he "interpreted or translated" them into english. He did claim later revelations, some of which were written - but not the core Mormon text. I have known many good and faithful Mormons and RLDS too and many teachings are closer to the realities presented in the 5th than many other christian religions. Perhaps I am mistaken about the Book of Mormon?

It is interesting that Mormons are taught that a "tribe of Israel" came by boat to South America as the Andites did indeed do.


Actually, the Book of Mormon (BOM) teaches that a single family, expanded by marriage and circumstance with a few additional men and women, were led by the Family Patriach out of the lands of Jerusalem, into the wilderness, and eventually to the Americas. Here is a summary from the Book of Mormon, itself:

"An account of Lehi and his wife Sariah, and his four sons, being called, (beginning at the eldest) Laman, Lemuel, Sam, and Nephi. The Lord warns Lehi to depart out of the land of Jerusalem, because he prophesieth unto the people concerning their iniquity and they seek to destroy his life. He taketh three days' journey into the wilderness with his family. Nephi taketh his brethren and returneth to the land of Jerusalem after the record of the Jews. The account of their sufferings. They take the daughters of Ishmael to wife. They take their families and depart into the wilderness. Their sufferings and afflictions in the wilderness. The course of their travels. They come to the large waters. Nephi's brethren rebel against him. He confoundeth them, and buildeth a ship. They call the name of the place Bountiful. They cross the large waters into the promised land, and so forth. This is according to the account of Nephi; or in other words, I, Nephi, wrote this record."

The story that individuals and families were led by prophetic warnings and revelations to leave a place of threat or danger and go into a safer, more promising land is not new to the Mormon faith, nor is it unknown to readers of TUB. Remember Adam & the Second Garden, for example?

The belief that the Book of Mormon is another Testimony of Jesus Christ should not overly worry readers of TUB; and of a truth, Latter Day Saints (Mormons) should not have a problem with the understanding that TUB is a revelation from God. Let me show you, from within the BOM itself just why.

[ BOM; Moroni 7:15-16 ] "For behold, my brethren, it is given unto you to judge, that ye may know good from evil; and the way to judge is as plain, that ye may know with a perfect knowledge, as the daylight is from the dark night. For behold, the Spirit of Christ is given to every man, that he may know good from evil; wherefore, I show unto you the way to judge; for every thing which inviteth to do good, and to persuade to believe in Christ, is sent forth by the power and gift of Christ; wherefore ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of God."

[ BOM; Moroni 7:17-18 ] "But whatsoever thing persuadeth men to do evil, and believe not in Christ, and deny him, and serve not God, then ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of the devil; for after this manner doth the devil work, for he persuadeth no man to do good, no, not one; neither do his angels; neither do they who subject themselves unto him. And now, my brethren, seeing that ye know the light by which ye may judge, which light is the light of Christ, see that ye do not judge wrongfully; for with that same judgment which ye judge ye shall also be judged."

[ BOM; Moroni 7:19 ] "Wherefore, I beseech of you, brethren, that ye should search diligently in the light of Christ that ye may know good from evil; and if ye will lay hold upon every good thing, and condemn it not, ye certainly will be a child of Christ."

[ BOM; Moroni 7:22-26 ] "For behold, God knowing all things, being from everlasting to everlasting, behold, he sent angels to minister unto the children of men, to make manifest concerning the coming of Christ; and in Christ there should come every good thing. And God also declared unto prophets, by his own mouth, that Christ should come. And behold, there were divers ways that he did manifest things unto the children of men, which were good; and all things which are good cometh of Christ; otherwise men were fallen, and there could no good thing come unto them. Wherefore, by the ministering of angels, and by every word which proceeded forth out of the mouth of God, men began to exercise faith in Christ; and thus by faith, they did lay hold upon every good thing; and thus it was until the coming of Christ. And after that he came men also were saved by faith in his name; and by faith, they become the sons of God."

These quotes from the text of the BOM clearly support the coming forth of the Urantia Book! They give faithful men and women tools to discern good from evil; and they encourage folks to find & adopt good and truth into their own lives. I know the Urantia Book is good, true, and beautiful! I know it seeks to "...inviteth to do good, and to persuade to believe in Christ..." and is therefore "...is sent forth by the power and gift of Christ..." to our world!

I rejoice in the harmony between the Book of Mormon and the Urantia Book. That harmony and encouragement is a wonderful example of some of the good that should be sought out and adopted by all believers in God, from wherever it should be found.

Edited by JR Sherrod, 07 December 2012 - 12:42 PM.

Ah! To be host to God, Himself; and to be enriched beyond measure by that incomprehensible treasure!

#52 Raymond

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:14 PM

I've just viewed the Len video! I was struck by his personal persistent quest for truth, his belief in a 'new bible', his correlations with the UB, his kindness,
his down-to-earthness, and his total belief in personal religious freedom!!! I am also struck by how he gives credit where credit is due - especially to organized religions. It made me ponder that we among the 1st receipients are truly revolutionaries - yet, also realizing that the UB is firmly seeded around the world and is continuing to be so. To me this has occurred with amazing light speed! Perhaps, just perhaps, we are on the verge of a marvelous new era. I even think that unconsciously it has arrived - that many of current catastrophies are in reality drawing mankind together - that mass knowledge offered by the internet age will push us even further. I just wanted to say thank you.

#53 Howard509

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 08:16 PM

There are many similarities between the Urantia Book and Mormon doctrine. Could it be that the Urantia Book is the "greater record to come" as foretold in the Book of Mormon? Could it even be that the Urantia Book was given as to correct where Joseph Smith's followers went wrong? The biggest difference I see between the Urantia Book and Mormonism is that while the Urantia Book emphasizes a personal relationship with the divine, Mormonism is an exacting institutional religion.

Edited by Howard509, 07 December 2012 - 08:19 PM.

We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience. -
Teilhard de Chardin


#54 Nelson G

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 08:39 PM

Could it even be that the Urantia Book was given as to correct where Joseph Smith's followers went wrong? __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ The Urantia Book is the fifth epochal revelation. Smith had a peak experience, probably similar to many other prophets, see-ers, visionaries and other truth seekers. David Koresh may have had a peak experience as well. Some do much better than others. The fifth is proportional to the fourth - don't you think?

I am not certain where Joseph Smith's followers went wrong??

Edited by Nelson G, 07 December 2012 - 08:41 PM.

Life often gives us our greatest gifts brilliantly disguised as our worst nightmares.

#55 Howard509

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 08:43 PM

I am not certain where Joseph Smith's followers went wrong??


The biggest difference I see between the Urantia Book and Mormonism is that while the Urantia Book emphasizes a personal relationship with the divine, Mormonism is an exacting institutional religion.

We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience. -
Teilhard de Chardin


#56 Nelson G

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 08:46 PM

The biggest difference I see between the Urantia Book and Mormonism is that while the Urantia Book emphasizes a personal relationship with the divine, Mormonism is an exacting institutional religion.


What is wrong with that?
Life often gives us our greatest gifts brilliantly disguised as our worst nightmares.

#57 Howard509

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:01 PM

The biggest difference I see between the Urantia Book and Mormonism is that while the Urantia Book emphasizes a personal relationship with the divine, Mormonism is an exacting institutional religion.


What is wrong with that?


From what I've heard, many people are disfellowshipped from the LDS for not agreeing on even trivial points of doctrine.

We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience. -
Teilhard de Chardin


#58 Nelson G

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:21 PM

My memory says it is called excommunication.
I did not think that they took action like that so lightly over a disagreement but it may be the case. Maybe the Mormons on board can expand on this.
The fact is however, when people join, they make agreements and committments.
Break the agreement and action like that should be expected.

I cannot find the quote from TUB but it was when Jesus was in a shop and a worker was complaining about his boss. Jesus inspired the worker to educate his boss because the worker obviously knew a better way - and the worker was successful.
Possibly this is an opportunity for people like you and I who are reaching for greater truths to get involved and help them out?
Life often gives us our greatest gifts brilliantly disguised as our worst nightmares.

#59 Howard509

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:25 PM

I am already a practicing Catholic so that would not be necessary. The Catholic Church hierarchy is somewhat rigid as well, but mostly only toward people who teach in their colleges and are forbidden from teaching after disagreeing with a church policy. Excommunication isn't as big of an issue as it was pre-Vatican II.

Edited by Howard509, 08 December 2012 - 04:59 PM.

We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience. -
Teilhard de Chardin


#60 Nelson G

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:40 PM

The church needs you brother.
I will hand it to you for being more involved than I am.
Life often gives us our greatest gifts brilliantly disguised as our worst nightmares.




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